I dont understand how you can make good points but then make the worst ones ever in the most condescending writing tone of all time. you must have a self harm kink to constantly white knight bungie, it is bungie and the communities fault... BUT not all the communities fault, dont lump in the people who didn't want this in with the ones who did, that is generalizing an opinion trying to manipulate some ones viewpoint to perceive it as something else. Yes the community (not all of it) was dragging it to this state, but bungie chose to do this anyways and abandoning the good will of its player base. I am sorry to say but your points no matter how good they are will never reach someone if you are acting more prideful then a slave owner about his belongings.

Go read the insulting nature of your own post, the strawman arguments that you spin out, and you will see why I take such a contemptuous tone when describing how this community behaves. The irony is that you’re just VALIDATING why it’s warranted. Anyone who disagrees with the hive mind is subjected to insults, harassment and efforts to bully them into silence. Which is why Bungie ignores us at this point. Actions have consequences.

Actions have consequences yes, but you think those actions should be paybacked with the same action? LMAO Bungie ignores the stupid people who still pay no matter what, I dont pay or play anymore. you lecture me on insulting nature? sir you are the king of it, calling the kettle black does not clean yourself of your actions. the hive mind is bad yes, but you have to realize, not all people are the same, so dont think or assume all of them are the same. and if they aren't the same they dont have to conform to your idea of what is different.

You came to me. …and I wasn’t even talking to you. If you want respect then show respect. I’m just returning the hostile energy that you came at me with. But if you expect me to dial back my contempt for the abuse towards Bungie staff that this place has handed out over the years? You’re going to have a long wait… because this community has earned it.

I wasnt asking for you too respect me, I am simply coming to you as a fellow human to ask, is returning the toxicity for toxicity worth it, and to not assume the whole community wanted this debacle, I have no personal vendetta against you besides the fact your assumptions lack a degree of temperament. And right now, maybe I am assuming something far beyond what I see, but in the end I cant excuse how you bite back to toxicity just as viciously as people bite you. if you want advice on how to not be a reactor and instead be an observer, take a long break from the game like I did, for months, it will feel lots better to not play the game and be stuck in its grinding loop that is a chore. plain quitting would also do wonders for your mental state (speaking from experience trust me)

Yes. It is worth it. Because you sometimes have to speak the language that the other party understands. I stand for principles, and if doing so makes me unpopular, the so be it. Like the entitlement, I don’t get this attitude of, “I deserve to feel good about myself no matter how badly I behave and how poorly I treat others,” …and I don’t want to get. I stand ten-toes down behind what I said. Later.

I read though all your responses to people from this, just wanted you to know I agree with your points. Too many people look at Destiny with such a narrow scope of the reality or bigger picture of why this game is what it is, and everyone is quick to blame Bungie for everything but no one wants to acknowledge that maybe part the problem is the community itself and how it burns itself out on grinding and how it has influenced the game design as a whole and how so many people have these wild expectations of what Bungie should do or how much content can be made in a short time. No one seems to remember the content drought of Taken King, how that led to making a new engine for D2 to make content faster, and when people were still finishing all the content too fast they started drip feeding the content over time starting with the annual pass, then evolved that into the seasonal model we've had since season 8, and everyone hates waiting week after week yet no one seems to grasp they did it this way because the amount of content diehard players burn through is too unrealistic for any company to fulfill such demands. Lots of players in this community have loud opinions yet a vast majority have not been paying attention nor have the knowledge to properly have the opinions they do. It's easy to scream at Bungie to do more or better but if you can't comprehend how they are supposed to do that and the technical difficulties that go along with that, then you get this, what the state of the majority of the community is right now. Crying children who have never ran a business or made a game, feeling entitled to dictate how the game should be even if it hinders other players or the company, and forgot how to properly play a game for fun and enjoyment, and know how to pace it out and take occasional breaks. Not a hard concept yet it sounds like many can't let go without having a fit about it thinking it makes a difference

Exactly. They forget that the reason this game is the way it is….is because Bungie altered to meet the demands and playing habits of the majority of the player base. I think we are just dealing with the player side of the conflict between those who wanted the game to be an “action-MMO” and those who wanted a successor to HALO. Only the losing side at Bungie (the HALO crowd) had the decency to leave the company. The losing side among the players refuse to leave. Instead they hang around like a stalker ex. Angry and embittered. Telling anyone who will listen how awful their ex is…while they refuse to let go and move on. While Bungie is literally having to resort to restraining orders.

It's really sad to watch. I have hope for the game, but not the player base. The people attracting attention with "I'm quitting Destiny" or "Bungie has abandoned the game" only show they have a toxic addiction to the game that they have to literally announce it to the world, as if Bungie will respond to them and give them a reason to come back. Any logical person would step away from something that was making them that upset or angry. What good does it do to keep bringing up why you are dissatisfied with something if it keeps adding to your frustration? On the one hand I get criticism, and the players have the freedom to voice what they like and dislike. But at what point do you stop, and just drop it? Move on and accept that it is out of your jurisdiction. Life is far too short to be getting worked up over things that are not nearly as important. It would be far better if everyone who hates Destiny would move on and stop wasting energy trying to validate why they think the game is bad. I'll play the game how I want to, at my own pace, and enjoy what I want out of it. I'll take a break and play something else when I'm bored. I don't need to hear other people's judgment and opinions of the game when all that matters is am I enjoying myself when I play. That's how you should play any game. A player should never feel like they have direct power to manipulate the company in shaping how the game is made, because that's a false sense of ownership that no gaming community truly has in any game. Every company that makes a video game, has final say in what their game is, what it stands for, and the experience it tells. We either play it because we like it, or we don't play it because it's not for us. It's like buying a book or a movie. You don't control how it gets made or what it tells, you either like it or don't. You never know if you like it unless you try it. I just think players treat games way too personally because the companies are too close and open to trying to cater their games around what the audience wants, and that has skewed expectations and given too many people this idea they deserve what they want because they paid for it to begin with.

[quote]1. We told Bungie that the micros were fine as long as Bungie didn’t sell power. (Pay to Win/Progress). Bungie has stuck by their word not to do so. Yet we keep moving the goalposts and complaining.[/quote] The first half is true, but the second half is totally BS. Supporting a business using a shop to help fund a game is one thing, but to gut the entire game to build the entire game around a stupid shop shoving it in the players face from what was offered vs now. Who the hell are you trying to fool here? "Moving the goalpost" 😄🤦‍♂️

Not BS and you know it which is why I’m not going to play this game with you. Get lost…or get muted. Your choice.

I don't care what you do, that's your choice, but most know what you said is BS and that is good enough for me. Oh, and It's not like you haven't muted me 5 times already according to you. Maybe stop spreading that BS as well 🤔

https://youtu.be/_M6mqIIGemQ Yep. Total BS. Your BS…as usual gaslighter.

You made your choice, gaslighter. Muted. Good bye and good riddance, troll.

We? Don't you mean you said it's OK?

No. I said “We”. Because there was a community consensus on these points back when Bungie was trying to work with us around how the store operated. But every time Bungie did what we asked, we kept saying it wasn’t good enough and would move the goalposts. We’d claim “They did what we asked, but they didn’t do it the right way….” Until finally Bungie got smart, and set a trap. They offered an emote for sale during an Iron Banner Week. It was purely cosmetic. It was sold as a separate item. It’s price was clearly marked. All the things that we had told Bungie would make a micro transaction “okay” in our eyes. What happened? [i]We pitched a screaming hissy fit. [/i] Raging about how ridiculous this was. How greedy Bungie was being. How this emote needed to be earnable in game…. The goalposts got up and moved again. Showing Bungie that our objections weren’t principled. We just wanted their stuff for free and would say anything to get it. That was the last time Bungie ever came yo us for feedback on how EV ran. Now they just tell us how things will be, and move on. The price of player [i]greed.[/i]

The way you describe it is so incredibly condescending, you make some points but you make it sound like you are always right and are a god... just admit you did get some stuff right or wrong jesus...

Sorry you feel that way. But the level of contempt that I feel for how we have behaved as a community is deserved….and it showing up in the tone of how I recount that behavior is not an accident.

So... your justifying your behavior as payback (maybe i am saying this as a hypocrite)... just like how the community sent death threats to the devs about twilight garrison? you justify your bad behavior solely by things that have happened to you then commit the same act. you have cornered yourself into being no worse then the thing you hate. I hate a lot of things, but i have a solemn honor to not stupe to doing what is wrong like that, and if I do i pull myself out of it. it seems you dont have the strength to let go and treat others differently from how you were treated/how you saw other treated. Malice of the same kind against malice of the same type is nothing but a way to corner yourself into weakness.

Wow. Now he’s going to try to reverse it. Let us behave badly, then claim victimization when the natural consequences for that behavior come around…. Standing up to bad behavior isn’t bad behavior. Especially when it is an accurate description of that behavior. Calling out bad behavior and standing up for people’s right to be treated with common courtesy isn’t “toxic”. Go play that mind game else where. People around here act as if there isn’t another human being on the receiving end of their toxic antics. …and if people are uncomfortable with their bad behavior being called exactly what it is? Oh, well. I don’t get this entitled attitude, and I don’t care to.