We are The Final Shape. It’s our Destiny. Despite what The Witness tells you The Game has already been decided. The Gardener saw to that. Because we are Destined to live and spread and fill the universe with Life. Literally been right on the cover since launch.

Final Shape is the last thing existing in the cosmos. That’s why the Final Shape is a concept for the Darkness and Winnower. So no.

Do you ever feel like you could be wrong about what the final shape is? Just curious.

[quote]Do you ever feel like you could be wrong about what the final shape is? Just curious.[/quote] Not really. I mean it’s a concept from the Winnower that defines the Darkness side. The Winnower explains it. First in the BoS back in D1 and then Unveiling in SK. So it’s been consistent. It’s the same concept, same principle, same end goal. Now that said, it’s a concept. It’s based solely on the Winnowers “purpose in life” unchecked by the Gardners purpose. Little more then a toaster who thinks it’s purpose should define reality. Its not a rule of the cosmos or anything, not like the sword Logic. So if you want to take it and say it means the Guardian after it becomes the supreme power or something else? Then YOU are redefining it to mean something else. So it’s not a question of others being wrong, it’s you making up something based loosely off an idea. I mean yeah, you can twist and turn things to make it fit but it doesn’t mean it’s a viable idea.

Oh I wasn't saying guardian, never have, been firmly against it. Been firmly against it being an entity, though too.

Oh yeah. I used that cause it’s a good example. As an idea, it makes some sense but since the term is already being used for a different concept it can’t fly. Wanted to show that an idea can seem pretty solid but for other reasons can’t work out.

See I'm for the witness or winnower being part of the final shape, in that they know the design, closing the story of everything... But... I'm for that closing leading to the explanation of nothing leading to the beginning. (Kinda of edit here, and I'm making it complicated by not just rewording the sentence after) Or the Final Shape (dlc) being the beginning of the end of the story...leads me to. Really you have Final Shape and their code name there after of matter. We go from this metaphysical understanding: energy, life, creation, entropy, consciousness... Just wrap that into matter and start creating a conscious entity. Then again, it is just a name.

Yes and no. Literally in the lore The Witness wagers what The Final Shape is. It’s a bet. One he’s sure of hold no “Destiny” Again it’s not completely clear if he’s talking about Death itself or The Vex. While The Gardener says she will make sure he’s wrong. By making herself a Law. IE The Traveler. Kill us with your shaping knives and swords. We’ll cheat Death to raise again to defeat The Witness. And there in lays The Witness’s miscalculation. If The Gardener sealed herself into a Law one that ensures Life, help it grow and build..... then DESTINY is a factor. For our Destiny was always to be The Final Shape.