{{
`${userDetail.user.displayName}${userDetail.user.cachedBungieGlobalDisplayNameCode ? `#${standardizeBungieGlobalCode(userDetail.user.cachedBungieGlobalDisplayNameCode)}` : ""}`}}
{{getUserClans()}}
Edited by kellygreen45:
9/1/2022 1:47:50 PM
322
No personal disrespect.
But you are simply getting a small taste of what average players experienced playing against you for the last 3 years under CBMM.
You are having to compete now if you want to win matches, rather than being allowed to dominate weaker players. Many of whom had little if any realistic chance to beat you.
The difference though is you have the skill to fight back, and the ability to compete.
What I’m hearing is that you don’t find this as enjoyable.
…and that’s the root issue here. The conflict between two irreconcilable definitions of fun. Those who enjoy competing against players of similar skill, versus those who enjoy dominating players of lesser skill.
One is competitive. The other is predatory.
The market is such that one game can no longer serve both. Which is why half of the Crucibles player base melted away over the last three years.
I’m always amazed at how so many high skill players expect average players to accept conditions that those same high skill players consider unacceptable for themselves.
English
-
You completely avoided everything I said because you know I'm right. My matches are not "better" as you dishonestly claimed, nor can you argue that Control is the appropriate playlist to try SBMM in. In fact, you didn't even try to address either.
-
No. I avoided the rest because it is irrelevant to the point I’m making. The clear fact that you have been oblivious to how most people experienced playing this game…and that those conditions were absurdly unfair. Which is why half the games players LEFT.
-
Edited by Desolator0: 9/1/2022 8:10:07 PM[quote]No. I avoided the rest because it is irrelevant to the point I’m making. The clear fact that you have been oblivious to how most people experienced playing this game…and that those conditions were absurdly unfair. Which is why half the games players LEFT.[/quote] Because you only make points that fall in favor of your false narrative that you like pushing, so you ignore the rest. I present the exact opposite of the skill bracket and I receive the exact opposite treatment: nothing but toxicity and "haha I'm glad your games suck now!" from spiteful people. Just read through this thread and see what I mean. Check their stats with their posts and you'll see a trend. My post seems to have beautifully exposed the double standard and hypocrisy that lies within a great amount of this game's PvP community.
-
No. I deal in facts. Go. Read. The. TWAB. Bungie clearly explains—using their in-house skill tracking, just how [i]awful[/i] the game had become. If you want to have a good faith discussion of this, then read that TWAB, and come back. Otherwise this is a waste of time. Because your agenda is simply to defend the privileges you’ve lost. Privileges that were destroying the game for others and would have eventually destroyed it for you as well in the long term. #TragedyOfTheCommons.
-
[quote]No. I deal in facts. Go. Read. The. TWAB. Bungie clearly explains—using their in-house skill tracking, just how [i]awful[/i] the game had become. If you want to have a good faith discussion of this, then read that TWAB, and come back. Otherwise this is a waste of time. Because your agenda is simply to defend the privileges you’ve lost. Privileges that were destroying the game for others and would have eventually destroyed it for you as well in the long term. [/quote] No matter how you couch yourself, you're a well-known narrative pusher, whether it's false or not, just like how you were so adamant about PvP and LoW yet were proven extremely wrong. And I've read the TWAB, as I read all TWABs, even the most useless, merch-pushing ones. Bungie's PvP game is miserable for many reasons, and while I can agree that the MM was partially one of them, there are MULTIPLE other reasons why their PvP sucks to play. MM was absolutely [b]not[/b] their biggest issue, and if they believe it is, then they are sorely misguided. And trying to gaslight players into believing that their self-improvement and getting better at the game as "privilege" is delusional. Me getting better at the game and beating others through no fault of the MM is a privilege? That's absolutely ludicrous. The MM had NOTHING to do with me getting better/worse as a player and stomping others, and by blaming the MM, it means you have a weak excuse-driven mindset and refuse to actually take the time to improve as a player. The same MM that people claimed to suffer under, I improved under. What does that tell you? Everything I say is inconvenient to narrative-peddlers like yourself because it would mean being unable to blame Bungie or a system out of your control for your failures. My games against worse players were not "privilege"; they were a consequence of me improving and them not. If they got better, they'd have no problems.
-
ROFLMAO. Thank you for showing that you are not coming to this discussion in good faith. In that TWAB Bungie stated that a skill gap of 600 between two players resulted in a matchup where it was statistically IMPOSSIBLE for the weaker player to win. IOW the outcome was decided before shots were fired. The also said that matches were there gaps of [b]900[/b] between the strongest and weakest players were COMMON. Which means top players commonly faced match ups that were non-competitive, and arguably ABUSIVE to the weaker player. But hey. As long as the game meets your needs, who cares? Right? This is why half the player base left, and why catering to players like you is a bad business move for a developer.
-
Edited by Desolator0: 9/3/2022 3:02:31 AM[quote]ROFLMAO. Thank you for showing that you are not coming to this discussion in good faith.[/quote] Who is more "good faith": the player who actively mains PvP and has the experience to back it up, knowing he'd get eviscerated on these forums for posting his experiences, or the one who hasn't broken past 315 LIFETIME PvP matches and feels he's an expert on it? Something to consider when you want to talk about intellectual honesty and opinions you should trust. [quote]In that TWAB Bungie stated that a skill gap of 600 between two players resulted in a matchup where it was statistically IMPOSSIBLE for the weaker player to win. IOW the outcome was decided before shots were fired. The also said that matches were there gaps of [b]900[/b] between the strongest and weakest players were COMMON.[/quote] No need to rehash what I've already read and know. Bungie also must not realize that Control has 12 people in a match. You might get unlucky and match against a sweat, sure, but that wasn't the case for every single team member or match you played. And if there was a problem with stacks as people claimed, then why hasn't Bungie taken the hint and made Freelance Control, as they should've years ago? [quote]This is why half the player base left, and why catering to players like you is a bad business move for a developer.[/quote] They left because PvP is being actively killed by Bungie themselves, not their MM. You're actually crazy if you want to blame CBMM for Bungie's own failures to incentive getting players in PvP and keeping them playing by rewarding them. You know... loot... in a looter-shooter game? And the only worthwhile PvP loot left to earn is in Trials. You are blaming a symptom for people leaving and not the disease itself. Catering to bad players like you is a bad business move because their PvP almost died once again the last time they tried SBMM. You cannot possibly and honestly keep blaming "the sweats", who comprise a TINY portion of the PvP player base as your boogeyman. It gets old fast.
-
Edited by kellygreen45: 9/1/2022 8:37:53 PMEh. You’re wasting my time. Your agenda is to bandwagon for yourself, with no regard for how others experience the game. Which is your right. I’m just not willing to play my part in that drama. Later.
-
[quote]Eh. You’re wasting my time.[/quote] See? You ignore valid counterpoints because they are inconvenient to your narrative after you tried once again to hijack my thread and peddle your false narrative. It didn't work and you bail. [quote]Your agenda is to bandwagon for yourself, with no regard for how others experience the game.[/quote] I literally want people to get better and for more maps and loot to be added. That's my agenda. I always advocate for player self-improvement and not begging Bungie to "fix" the game for them and rig it in their favor. MM was never the problem and reading this from someone like me should really make you rethink your stances on PvP just a little bit. But since you don't understand what I want and don't want to engage since I won't play into your narrative, goodbye. I will still be here if you want to talk.
-
Nothing you’ve said is valid. You’re arguing pure, unprincipled, self-interest. Which you’re welcome to do. I just don’t care to play. Good day.
-
[quote]Nothing you’ve said is valid. You’re arguing pure, unprincipled, self-interest.[/quote] I'm sure you're arguing from a purely community-interested, altruistic perspective too (as if that's even possible to reasonably argue in the place of hundreds of thousands of people collectively in a game). Judging from your stats and prior opinions, this isn't the case. You, me, and every single other person have just as much skin in the game too, so don't act like arguing for yourself is even a bad thing. Have a good day, too.
-
Actually I am arguing for the good of the game because I have no dog in this fight. But you can’t see that. Literally.
-
Just making a quick point, as someone who breaks top 1% every once in a while, and plays top 500s fairly regularly, it certainly feels like a sweatfest. But that also means that I'm not getting absolutely smashed, and neither is the enemy team. When I'm playing well I can still make plays and get good streaks, 1v2s and 1v3s, but I'm not just romping through a box of puppies. It's definitely not a sit back and relax experience anymore, but it's more fair to the overall population for sure. I started really poorly in D1, so I definitely get what both sides feels like.
-
Makes perfect sense. It’s now a competitive environment instead of a predatory one. Only you seem to still remember what it was like being on the menu when you weren’t at the top. The irony is that these other guys are demanding that weaker players endure WORSE conditions that they insist are unacceptable for themselves. If they don’t like playing other top players, how do they think it feels to be the average player going up against them and getting curbstomped?!?!?
-
Exactly. I've matched against 3.0s recently, and it hurts for sure. But there's an amazing feeling when you pick one, or make the match somewhat close. Every player should be able to feel like there's q chance in the match.
-
don't sweat it bro, I'm not a 1%er but I'm in a high enough bracket i fully understand what you're talking about, also i play with a fair amount of sub 1% and a couple top 500's. Its brutal, its just not something most people understand or care too. the truth is most people don't actually care about fairness or fun, they just care that they're having a good time, and when they're not its cause the game system 'is just to unfair'. Its brutal right now even in my bracket, cant imagine yours. Good vibes dude, if you need a team sometime hit our clan up. Cant promise better matches but least youll laugh on the way.
-
And how do you think everyone ELSE feels about going up against those same players? Seriously…. The issue is simply one of not caring about how the game is experienced by the community as a whole.
-
You've been one of the few chill, respectful people in this thread, and I appreciate that a ton. Thanks for the offer dude. I totally agree with you btw, well said.
-
He’s just one of the few who agrees with you. Because you both only seem to care about how the game is experienced by those at the top. I’m trying to explain to you how everyone else is experiencing it, and you simply don’t want to hear it.
-
you don’t care how it’s experienced by anyone whose not in the bottom 50%. Stop projecting yourself as the people champion when you just want things easier for yourself. If you were to just be honest and say I don’t like PvP nor want to invest time in it, I could respect that but instead you’re trying to use the “as a whole“ argument which does the same thing you’re claiming to argue against - it negatively effects players who have put the time in. No one ever plays a game has a bad time and thinks “well at least other people are having fun, I guess I’ll keep playing”. Making the game more frustrating for your core players is a bad thing. (See D2Y1) If sbmm was the best choice the ranked playlist would’ve been the main game mode for years now, But it’s not not has it EVER been.
-
Actually I do. What I don’t care about are those who complain about having to face people of their own skill level.
-
[quote]I’m trying to explain to you how everyone else is experiencing it, and you simply don’t want to hear it.[/quote] Newsflash: I used to suck at this game too. I used to get stomped. I know exactly how it feels and plays and I know the mindset of bad players because I had it. Do you assume I installed D2 and magically started being amazing? Nonsense.
-
Here’s something you need to think about when the skill gap is extremely large there is almost no improvement at all
-
Sorry, I'm not sure what you're trying to say. Could you please explain?
-
Edited by ArtAce-71: 9/3/2022 3:07:06 AMWhen the players you are facing are far better players than you you cannot improve because some many levels of skill are skipped
