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1/21/2021 2:56:07 PM
203
Sunsetting is a foundational aspect of loot games and MMOs.
English
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[quote]So they should scammed the people for they money? I do not think that is good solutionl.[/quote] Unless someone sold you a game that was unplayable (like CDPR did) , no one scammed anyone. [quote]As for state of Destiny I would argue that much bigger problems are loot acqusition, game progresion (rookie to Raider) and older destinations/activities have no place.[/quote] Which are all manifestations of Bungie's lack of bandwidth for loot production. Nos 1 and 3 are broken directly because of it. No 2 is broken because Bungie leans on drawing out progression to the limits of human endurance so they can keep us playing. Because the game can't make enough loot for chasing after it to have that effect. [quote]So why is good to add another weak point by showing another weak point and manpower sink?[/quote] Because its forcing Bungie to fix a problem that they've been ignoring for years. A problem that....as we've been discussing....is the root cause of a number of this game's other problems.
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Well my copy of Cyberpunk 2077 is playable thank you for asking. I would much more p*sed if I get acces to destinations from which only loot I can use are Blues and potentionaly Raid weapons if I got lucky and get group. No, the number of new weapons could be higher but with Season model we get steady stream. Problem is more in the ways we are geting them. I am thinking more akin changes like: [url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=00Lq54AUv3w&list=PLe1FsOaqMz3WqpkKn5VCcl55BAJ3P0J6r&index=5&t=1083s[/url] I am not saying that this 100% solution, but closer then stiring Destiny into MMO. Also you think loosing players and having negative feedback is forcing Bungie to do anything? Oh come on. Since when? [url]https://steamcharts.com/app/1085660[/url]
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1. Because, I assume you bought it on Steam. If you had bought it for PS4 or Xbox 1 I'd bet you'd feel VERY differently trying to play a game with worse graphics than PS3, and running at 15 fps. (By the way the minimum frame rate for the brain to interpret animation as continuous motion is 24 fps.) 2. DESTINY ISN'T A PC-BASED GAME. So please stop quoting Steam chards and trying to generalize what is going on there to the entire game. Destiny 2 is played on FOUR platforms. PC...PSN...XBox...and Stadia. Also with cross save, that allows players to migrate from one platform to another wtihout losing their progress. I currently play on all four....and actively on three of the four. PC is losing players because it has such an out-of-control cheating problem that Bungie is having to fight it out in court trying to SUE the makers of these hacks. We've just had the launch of PS5 and Xbox Series X...which now offer PC level graphics and frame rate performance....but without the cheating problems. So there is---at this point---very little reason to continue to play this game on PC and continue to endure the problems on that Platform 3. Warmind.io publishes engagement numbers accross all platforms. Yesterday's numbers: Overall 883K PVE: 821 K Crucible: 303 K Raids: 121K Event: 60.3 K Which is exactly where this game has sat in terms of player numbers for nearly the last two years at te end of a season. The only number that is below expectations is Crucible at 303K (Crucible is usually around 500K)....and even this decline is typical for those times when CBMM is the only way to play 6v6. As average players stop playing the Crucible. The notion that this game is in "crisis" is a false narrative, being pushed by an angry minority of players who are losing a struggle over control of the game. Fact is that player numbers are higher NOW than they were during Forsaken which is the (false) "good old days" that so many disgruntled players now want to point to as the "ideal" version of the game that Bungie somehow screwed up.
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1) That is all nice and dandy but I got somewhat functionale game so I am more or less satisfied. As for other versions I can not speak. Also I bought it at gog.com. Do I look like an uncultured swine? 2) Nope, according to warmind.io playerbase on Steam is comparable with console as it is 30% to 40% players playing on PC. Since Forsaken the share of players playing on PC is rather growing then dwindling so can you link to site telling otherwise? [url]https://warmind.io/activity[/url] 3) My dude the game we are all playing is called Capitalism and if your profits are not growing, you are losing. In order to invest in project such project need to be profitable and profit margins being on the rise. It could be achieved via lurking more customers or making your curent customers pay more. Alternative is to limit your investmnet and try something new (cough, cough Matter).
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Edited by kellygreen45: 1/22/2021 9:08:09 PM[quote]Nope, according to warmind.io playerbase on Steam is comparable with console as it is 30% to 40% players playing on PC. Since Forsaken the share of players playing on PC is rather growing then dwindling so can you link to site telling otherwis[/quote] Can't do that. You are trying to make the PC playerbase a representative sample through FIAT ("it is because I said so") and you can't do that because I've already given you MULTIPLE reasons why it isn't. That is PC has MULTIPLE reasons why its shedding players that don't apply to any of the console versions or on Stadia. Also with cross-save people can leave the platform without leaving the game. So players simply migrate from one platform to another. This is why science....and logic...have RULES. To counter this human tendency to want to start witht he desired CONCLUSION....and then try to manipulate the facts to justify that conclusion. That is working the issue BACKWARDS. The facts are that---franchise wide----the player numbers are stable. So you need to adjust your beliefs to fit that objective reality. Not try to twist and cherry pick things to try to get around that fact and support what you wish to believe to be the truth.
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So can you support your claim by number comparison between player population on diferent platforms in time? As far as I can tell you have showed none. Also stable player count is not death of the franchise but definitly reason to invest in the game accordingly. Or change the model: [url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xNjI03CGkb4[/url]
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So basically all of this power is coming from pinnacle weapons more than likely or am i wrong on that? Do you think random god roll weapons could have enough power to cause the same issues as pinnacles?
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No. Pinnacles were just the most obvious example. Super-regen exotic armor were another example of power creep run amok. Pre-nerf The Reckoning is what the game looks like when they try to tune the game to the power creep. Unless to design the game to deal with this in an ongoing and sustainable fashion, the problem just keeps coming back in different forms.
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What do you think of the idea of un-sunsetting pinnacle weapons but only allowing them a few hours of availability everyday or a few hours every other day or even a few hours just on the weekend? Basically the goal would be to give people the freedom to use them but for a certain amount of time.
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Doesn't fix the problem. The only way to fix the problem is to take that power away from people. I said that 5 years ago when Bungie added infusion to the franchise. You can't DO that in a loot game. You can't give people power and let them keep it forever. Bungie created an impossible and unreasonable expectation in the player base. They never had any hope of making this work...and now they need to walk it back. People need to just LET IT GO. Trying to hang onto this notion of "I should get to keep it forever" is just going to destroy the game....and trying to kick the can down the road instead of fixing the game is only going to delay it. Not prevent it.
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[quote]What do you think of the idea of un-sunsetting pinnacle weapons but only allowing them a few hours of availability everyday or a few hours every other day or even a few hours just on the weekend? Basically the goal would be to give people the freedom to use them but for a certain amount of time.[/quote] I feel you bro. You want to play with your guns. All you ever wanted from this game is to play with your toys that you deservedly acquired from doing their respective quests. Bunyon dangled this carrot to you, you acquired the carrot as a reward. And now Bunyon took it away from you. Now you want it back? 😂 This is what they want. This is what they do. It's a trick! They dangle the carrot to milk you. They take away the carrot. And now you want more carrots. Get ready, you know what's coming, right? MILK! 😂That's their next step! There's a saying, "A sucker is born every minute!" Don't be one!
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The trick was telling you that you could keep it forever. Because NONE of these games can allow you to do that without destroying themselves in the process.
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[quote]The trick was telling you that you could keep it forever. Because NONE of these games can allow you to do that without destroying themselves in the process.[/quote] This is old news Kelly. You've been saying this over and over like a broken record. Aren't you getting tired? You sound like a DJ has been scratching your mouth on the turntable at a club. It's too repetitive now. Do you have something new for me I haven't heard before from you? Move away from the turntable and maybe something may come up. An idea, anything. Just give me something different. Don't tell me you are gonna mute me. Cuz I've heard that from you before too. Aight, give me something fresh. Okay?
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Edited by kellygreen45: 1/23/2021 2:16:22 AMThe truth doesn’t change. So no, I’m not getting tired of advocating for it. I am getting tired of all the temper tantrums though. Part of maturity is the ability to hear and accept the truth of something. Even it is undesired and unpleasant. You can’t fix a problem if you cannot accept the reality of it. You can use your energy to fix the problem or to fight the problem...and right now this community is fixated on fighting the reality a problem that isn’t ever going to go away. Because Bungie has finally accepted that they will destroy this game if they didn’t finally start sunsetting gear....and Bungie isn’t going to destroy their own game in the long run to make an angry minority of players (who will only abandon the game in that long run) in the short term. Would be a colossally stupid move on their part, on top of the stupid move they made five years ago that brought us to this point.
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Calm down Kelly. Seems like you need some of that maturity you are talking about yourself. You are repeating yourself again, over and over again. Seems like that is also borderline tantrums. Relax. The game is not destroyed. Do you know what I call a destroyed game?...When nobody is playing it anymore. Then it's destroyed. That's the only time you or me can say it's truly destroyed. Right now, it's not. It's on a stable population. Has been for a 3 years now. Went up to over 2 million at Forsaken. But now game has a steady 1 million plus for a couple years now on major expansions and DLCs. The game is not destroyed yet Kelly. So I don't know what you are talking about. Game is alright. Numbers slowly declining, but this is a boring time since content are running out at end of seasons, and game is really getting boring around end of season. Question is, nobody really knows who is who in that 1 million plus remaining playerbase because you have the vets and the new light mixed together in one population. We don't really know the numbers in terms of percentage who are the vets and how many are new light. Not to mention who are playing the free trial version and who are paying gamers. And the game just got a deal and some support from Microsoft's gamepass. That should keep the game afloat for now. So really Kelly, I don't know what you are talking about the game will be destroyed. Again, you are repeating this over and over again like a broken record. You might want to step away from that turntable for a much newer perspective.
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Edited by kellygreen45: 1/23/2021 3:38:26 AM“Rationalization are the ad hoc smoke that billow up from emotional fires. You do not deal with rationalizations as if they were principled, reasoned arguments any more than you would put out a fire by standing around waving at the smoke. [i]You put out a fire by putting out the fire.[/i] But if that is not enough, and the fires keep coming back? Then you put out the arsonists.” —-Drew Westen. You’re watching me put out the arsonists. You put them out by sticking to the facts and refusing to budge. Just like dealing with an angry toddler throwing a tantrum. When they realize it doesn’t work, and doesn’t get them what they want? They stop doing it....and they grow out of it. Give in and let them have it just to make them stop raging? They’ll never grow out of it, and you’ll never be rid of the toxic behavior.
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I've already said this to you Kelly in another post. It's just a videogame Kelly. Nobody is destroying anything here. You are going to a place where it's not happening yet. And I'm not going there with you. I can't see what's happening in the future, and I don't have a crystal ball. All I know is that it's just a videogame Kelly. And fans just want to have fun in a game that they have come to love over the years. They are not burning it down. They just want to have fun. It's a game and that's what it's all about Kelly.
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You can keep saying that all you want but you are engaging in self-deception. The reason why these rules are rules because the player psychology that these games rely upon to survive doesn’t change, Three games that I have played have run afoul of these rules and nearly destroyed themselves: [i]Diablo 3.[/i] [i]The Division 1[/i] [i]Destiny 2.... twice.[/i] As the team leader for Diablo 3 said: [i]Gamers are often their own worst enemies and will destroy their own experience of the game if you let them. Which means that it is up to the developer at times to step in and tell them “No”.[/i] Bungie is telling us “No”. We can’t let you keep stuff forever anymore. It’s breaking the game, And this community is raging like a toddler throwing a tantrum in the middle of the store because Mommy want buy the toy he wants.
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You are reverting back to where we were Kelly. We are back on page one again. Here you go again, back like a broken record again Kelly. I told you before I already heard this. You have to step away from that turntable so you don't look like a broken record scratching your mouth like a DJ in a club. We are back here Kelly. Back on page one again.
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Because the facts don’t change and won’t budge. The fact that they are inconvenient and don’t feel good is unfortunate but are ultimately irrelevant.
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[quote]Because the facts don’t change and won’t budge. The fact that they are inconvenient and don’t feel good is unfortunate but are ultimately irrelevant.[/quote] I'm getting tired of this scratchy broken record Kelly. So if you want to play this game, I'll revert you back to our first posts above. Then just follow it until you reach this one. Then do it all over again. Like in the game, just rinse and repeat Kelly. Just rinse and repeat.
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Facts are stubborn things.
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Edited by Phyromancer: 1/23/2021 4:54:40 AM[quote]Facts are stubborn things.[/quote] Precisely, that's why I'm drilling it to you but you have to follow instructions. Rinse and repeat from the top Kelly. From the top.
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I only take orders from those who pay me for the privilege. And since you aren’t....I’ll do as I please, thanks Which in this case is reiterating the only things that are [i]relevant.[/i]
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[quote]I only take orders from those who pay me for the privilege. And since you aren’t....I’ll do as I please, thanks Which in this case is reiterating the only things that are [i]relevant.[/i][/quote] Sure Kelly. You know your way around here. They're called opinions Kelly. They are everywhere. Just like yours. But all I see now is a DJ scratching your head on the turntable. Broken record Kelly. You sound like a broken record now. Take it easy Kelly Green. And watch the foam in the mouth. Don't stay too long scratching it on the turntable.
