Once you do an act, it's like an imprint on your soul and you'll find yourself falling back on those habits and logic. Uldren is going to need to earn a lot of trust at this point.

Yeah but uldren wasnt acting on his own .. Riven was in control of him .. So is it really his fault?

Would you believe the killer who said the devil/demons made me do it? No. You wouldn't.

Well we know the history of what the ahamkara are capable of so I'd have to say yes I would believe it.

We as people are aware of that. Our guardian is not. As a matter, we only know ahamkara can grant wishes, and Riven, as ahamkara, was not wished to directly as far as we know. Her best line to include an idea of supposition is: "I thought they'd never leave. You and I are not done. We're inseparable now. Through your actions, we've forged an age-old-bond between my kind and yours. One wish granted deserves another. [b]And I cannot wait to show you what SHE asked for.[/b] O murderer mine..." - Siren of Riven Which could be any number of the powerful hive including the dungeon boss. Part of knowing what we know is to simply tell the story. Creating conflicting emotions and guesswork is why even brilliant minds will not step over. It proves only what you want to hear.

Our guardians absolutely are aware of what is going on its not me just simply knowing the lore and applying it lol petra says uldren has been corrupted by riven at one point or another during the campaign of forsaken & we even see it during the end mission .. So I still stand by what I said lol

[quote]Our guardians absolutely are aware of what is going on its not me just simply knowing the lore and applying it lol petra says uldren has been corrupted by riven at one point or another[/quote] The fact I have to explain this means you don't think about the lore as much as others. You don't get this. To what extent is Uldren corrupted? Is he willfully letting his desires shape the situation or is riven actually doing it? Which is the dominant force? Which one contributed to him in that moment? One side of the coin is what most people believe and know ahamkara to do: Bring out your inner demon. Whatever is down there. The others? Forgive uldren because it was the magic desire coming from riven which uldren followed upon. In one version he is a victim of circumstance. The other? Is he wanting to kill cayde because he never liked him? What is the motivation for that or any other possible circumstance? You must choose to believe one side or the other, but the reality is? You think the player and the guardian are relatively the same when they aren't.