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Edited by ChickenHawk110:
9/16/2015 5:46:44 AM
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I agree and I disagree.
You are correct about most of your post. I suspect you couldn't care, but here is another take on it.
[b]Endgame activities have been taken away from me.[/b] I know you have already covered your opinion on the matter, but I would disagree to a small extent. They could have left an option to do LvL34 Nightfall with non-TTK rewards, which would still give me a more difficult weekly mission, likely with burns. No real downside too it except the super small effort if would have taken the dev's.
In Crucible, my stats used to give me my Super in about 3:30 without any kills, and my grenade used to take about 25 seconds to come back.
Now, my Super is 5:14 to get it back, and my grenades take 0:55 seconds, that is a reduction in power that will make a significant difference to my game during Crucible. Yes, every guardians power has been nerfed, but any level 40's with new 280 armour that will get the stats back up again will have a significant advantage for their Supers, Grenades and Melee. They are quite free to enter regular Crucible in the non-TTK playlist and dominate because of their power advantage.
[b] My "even playing field" in "light levels disabled Crucible" has been taken away from me.[/b]
[b]My choice of Crucible game mode has been taken away from me. I like Big Team, I dislike Free For All[/b]
Another thing that was specifically taken away from many guardians is the Hopscotch Pilgrim. Its now just an 55A-Allfate. I actually have an Allfate and a Hopscotch with identical perks, and now identical stats. There has not been any other weapon archetype changes in all of Y1. There wasn't any history or inference anywhere that this thing could even happen as I spent my time grinding to get the HP, and NO-ONE would have spent that amount of time grinding for an Allfate archetype pulse rifle. There are many more reasons as to why that particular decision was deceptive and shady as hell from Bungie but no need to cover them here.
[b]My specific weapon was literally taken away from me.[/b]
[b]Iron Banner and Trials of Osiris have been taken away from me.[/b] IB was with vanilla and ToO was purchased with HoW. If a player really wants to enter those events strongly underleveled, I believe Bungie is being scummy by stopping them. ToO really was a selling feature for HoW, not a selling point for TTK.
Those are the reasons that I feel I have had content taken away from me, do you see anything wrong or inaccurate with my reasons?
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It was just a way they could push people to buy the dlc
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I see where you are coming from, but once again everything you listed to me are "Features" not content. But agree to disagree.
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You make a valid point, except for the fact that Iron Banner and Trials are the PvP endgame activities, so see above.
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Actually, ToO was advertised as content for HoW.
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It was introduced in HoW yes, but it never said that it was strictly tied to it and would be frozen in time with it. "Coming with HoW" does not equal "Staying with HoW"
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I'm saying it was advertised as part of it. While they never said it would stay in place, they also never said you would have to pay another 40 to play it again a few months later.
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It says point blank in the EULA they can change stuff however they see fit. You agreed to that.
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Doesn't change the matter that it's shady as hell.
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It's pretty standard "incentivize a purchase" practice actually. Like it or not. Would Destiny be better of more people played? Yes. Should Bungie give non TTK owners more incentive to keep playing? Yes. But nobody is being "robbed" and what they did is completely within the EULA everyone agreed to by playing.
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Yes, legally, they are within every right to. I know that. Morally? It's a bit wrong. But that's not big business anymore. Money over morals. It's a bit sad, actually.
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Edited by The New Monarch: 9/16/2015 3:40:08 PMYou're first point was about Nightfalls. Why are you playing an endgame activity that isn't actually endgame and would only give rewards that you probably already have and wouldn't help you be anymore powerful in year one content? You wouldn't...it's meant for the endgame and is a feature of the expanded game not the base. It continues to grow and change with every addition. You never payed for Nightfall, it was an endgame feature that was relevant in vanilla and then adapted for TDB and every expansion since. The same is true for Iron Banner and Trials...I'm sorry but you don't have an argument here. This is coming from someone who never liked Halo. I am the furthest thing from a Bungie fanboy and I played the base game for months before buying the 2 expansions and never felt a reason to complain. Love it or leave it man...I hope you at least had fun
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"Why are you playing an endgame activity that isn't actually endgame and would only give rewards that you probably already have and wouldn't help you be anymore powerful in year one content? You wouldn't..." Incorrect. I did have everything. I DID play nightfalls to potentially get rewarded with shit I already had. Wow, what's this? A completely different anecdotal experience than yourself? What a surprise? Also note, Nightfalls WASNT locked away in TDB or HoW unless the Nightfall strike was Omnigul or Taniks. This complete lockout decision is genuinely new. And thats why people call BS. I vehemently disagree that Iron Banner and ToO is "end game content". Just agree to disagree huh? Works for me. You look cute today. Have you been working out?
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Yea, but the nightfalls level was raised multiple times, correct? And if I'm correct the only reason it wasn't relocked for you was because the Max level only increased by 2 each DLC meaning if you were maxed out when each DLC dropped then you were still withing three levels(you need to be within 3 levels to play a game mode with a level requirement). The only reason you are being excluded now because its a 42 strike and your max level is 34... Seems to make sense to me. Both Iron Banner and Trials of Osiris are endgame activities with level advantages enabled you wouldnt want to play it anyways. And to add onto that the finally added DLC maps to the rotation and put back some of the old ones. Crucible got super stale with out those maps and having them ONLY in a separate playlist meant they didn't get touched as often. You might think they are blocking content. But as OP said. This is how they've been doing it for over a decade. Not destiny itself but MMOs as a whole. It sucks, but better than the alternative method that you guys want. You support destiny, you get the latest content. Simple as that.
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I view Destiny as a service. You have to pay for it to use it. And I'm fine with this because it's a pretty small cost in the long run.
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This thrice yearly DLC is just a veiled subscription model because a subscription model is unlikely to work on consoles. Everybody see's this, its not rocket science. How would you feel if Bungie decided to literally take a piece of equipment away from you? Just like that. Its done. You no longer have it, and the time you spent acquiring said piece of equipment was rendered moot... What would your thoughts be on that?
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[quote] How would you feel if Bungie decided to literally take a piece of equipment away from you? Just like that. Its done. You no longer have it, and the time you spent acquiring said piece of equipment was rendered moot... What would your thoughts be on that?[/quote] They did. I had to delete so much of my exotics and year 1 weapons to make room for my new stuff because they were old and useless. It did hurt a bit.
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A veiled subscription model it may be because, you're right, but it still comes down to it being a service. Console users in general don't want to pay for subscriptions. Even still, it comes out to around $8 a month, which is still cheaper than other high-quality subscription games. Again, a small cost in my mind. If Bungie took away a piece of equipment, I would be mad, but Bungie has not taken away any of my equipment. What piece of equipment did they, as you put it, "literally take away" from you? You say that stuff was literally taken away from you, then you state that you feel like stuff was taken away from you.
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My Hopscotch Pilgrim pulse rifle had its archetype changed. It was exclusively the only weapon that was changed. It is now identical to an 55A-Allfate and the Hopscotch Pilgrim, even though it retains the name, is no longer.
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That's dangerously intelligent for these here forums Couldn't agree more
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all valid points but this was the same thing that happen in the dark below and house of wolves. people said this wasnt fair and they are losing content. way i look at it $40 is a small price to pay the hours ill be playing it. i over 1,000 hours of destiny from the base game plus the 2 add ons at just 1,000 hours its only 6 cents an hour for entertainment lol where else can you go and have fun with friends for that price?
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all valid points but this was the same thing that happen in the dark below and house of wolves. people said this wasnt fair and they are losing content. way i look at it $40 is a small price to pay the hours ill be playing it. i over 1,000 hours of destiny from the base game plus the 2 add ons at just 1,000 hours its only 6 cents an hour for entertainment lol where else can you go and have fun with friends for that price?
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It seems a little out there to complain about losing endgame content when you're no longer at the endgame...
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That is the [i]grey[/i] area of the debate. You are no longer at the endgame, that is definitely one way of looking at it. But with previous updates thus far, Nightfall was only locked out to players that didn't purchase when the new DLC strike was the one selected for the Nightfall. All players could do the Nightfall when it was a vanilla strike for Nightfall that week. That has changed now. You are locked out. I cannot agree that Iron Banner and ToO must be considered endgame content. Many players that never went near a raid or other "end game" activities generally participated in both those PvP activities at level 31 in TDB and level 33 in HoW by simply using vendor gear and an Exotic piece. There was no apparent difference, as in the actual damage per shot was identical, when the level difference was just 1 level. Again, that has changed now. You are locked out. What about my other points? Do I have no leg to stand on with my other points or what?
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Edited by RhymesWithMoose: 9/16/2015 7:59:22 PMThe answer is... Complicated. Some of the Crucible changes are poor design, because they split up the player base - never good, and also foolish on the business side of things. I'm not sure if you can get the 34 TTK blue stuff or not, but if you can it may make a difference as the impact of strength et al varies with level (requiring 60 per tier at 40). As much as the pulse rifle changes annoy me, though, I can't get up in arms about a balance change, because balance must come first. You're mistaken about Iron Banner and Trials, however - those are very much endgame, specifically, they're endgame PvP, which is a different ecosystem with different standards of entry from endgame PvE. All that said, there's a reality here to consider: in games like Destiny, keeping up on the expansions (which TTK is, while TDB and HoW are content packs) is part of the price of admission. Certain things cannot be designed for both people who have it and people who don't. The question you have to ask yourself is if you're willing to pay that price.
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Edited by DaKineTyKai: 9/16/2015 9:55:50 AMI would like a refund. Should a company get to keep my money if I don't get to keep the product I paid for? Edit: Activision makes no guarantee regarding the availability of online play or features, and may modify or discontinue online services at its discretion without notice. I guess I can't be salty.
