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Edited by FrugMaddict: 9/7/2015 6:00:08 PM
133

Why taking away weapon rolling is bad and lazy (edited)

[b]Check the bottom for my final thoughts and thoughts about a solution.[/b] (The rest is still relevant.) First off, I might say some general things as I go through my argument. If you're one of the weirdos that can escape the norm, then good job, but please focus on the individual point I'm trying to make. 1) [b]RNG is not a sole solution:[/b] possibly the most annoying thing is that we will be at the mercy of RNG again. Do you really want random luck to decide who has the good stuff? Given that legendaries, and most importantly their rolls, will be based off of pure RNG, a few things can be found using the probability stats of a normal bell curve (I've taken multiple stats courses, RNG follows this pattern). First, that around 68% of us are going to get weapons that are merely around decent. 13% are going to get "pretty crappy" weapons, while the 13% on the other side are going to get "pretty good" stuff. Finally, in the same way, only [b][i]around 3%[/i][/b] (of the millions of players) are going to get the best (and vice versa). I wasn't born into royalty, and I don't think I'm going to win the lottery here. 2) [b]For those that don't like everyone having the same thing:[/b] first off, in a similar situation, people are generally going to want the same thing. Regardless, the number of people with the same thing is even higher than that (meaning that there's something else at play). However, it wasn't weapon rolling that created this problem, it just revealed it. The problem is the lack of balance. Which we all know about (and will supposed to be better but, knowing Bungie, may be over-corrected and turned into a different problem). Don't forget the maps! A lack of diversity in maps plays a big hand in what weapons are used. 3) [b]There's still other things:[/b] Bungie needs to get more specific when it comes to tweaking things. They're nerfing perks like shot package because of its effectiveness when compounded with other perks, but what if it was ok on its own (remember, not just talking about shot package here)? Why not control or tweak perk combinations instead of just perks alone? Now if we get one of those diminished perks [i]without[/i] it having other perks that make it even better, it'll fall short of what it was meant to. Besides all that, weapon rolling allowed people to explore as they wanted. Sure, if people are stuck with whatever the hell is dropped for them there'll be different things being used, but do you think it'll be anything close to what they want? Do you think they'll be happy about it? Also, other good perks can be made (and may have been). That's another way to up diversity --- by creating multiple roads to success. Do you think everybody chose the same thing because there was just so many great perks to choose from? Bungie replaced field scout with crap, so yes, that's going to be generally passed up. Bungie can make [i]great[/i] things happen when they get creative, so we just need more of that. There's my argument. Agree? Disagree? What do you people think? It's going to be very difficult to change my mind, but feel free to try. [b]Other important note:[/b] yes re-rolling also uses RNG, but you can get a different roll [i]much[/i] faster than you can get the same weapon, let alone trying to get a specific weapon over and over again trying to get a perfect roll. Although I'm not a fan of RNG being used here either, that is why I'm less concerned about it in the re-roll function. [b]Final thoughts and thoughts about a solution:[/b] in the end I do have some confliction. I don't think everybody using the same thing would be too much fun, but I really don't like the idea of having the best stuff handed out at random. Now if I had it my way, there'd be more balance and more perks that people would like. That would make more variety of everything. Would that create enough variety, though? I couldn't say. But there's one solution that came to me: have us keep doing things as before, with nothing but RNG, but every once in some while we could do some quest or other and change a weapon however we wanted. Does this sound a lot like TTK? Yes. I've ignored TTK in this post because although we know some things, we don't know [i]everything[/i], and it may be important that we do. But from what I've heard the gunsmith will have a very similar solution to mine. After you do a quest, you can get a gun with a few options for the perk sets. So with this information possibly making this whole damn post moot, how does this compromise work for you?

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  • I think that there should be more perks but the chance of you getting something like shot package on a shotgun lower

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  • Weapon rolling was a huge mistake

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    • Considering you can keep rolling till you get the perfect combo making a gun much more viable that others I disagree. If they limited how many rolls you can do...then maybe, but as it is no.

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    • Limit weapon rerolls to 3. After that you are stuck with the weapon or you have grind for another.

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      I was never unhappy with how it worked before reforging, it was actually a ton better. It gave some excitement to a drop. Now, I really just needed 1 sniper rifle to drop and 1 rocket launcher, and then any other drops were merely weapon parts for my reforging. Obviously over infinite time, chances are people will have the best stuff, and things would be similar. But I don't personally care if everyone else can reforge or get their weapons custom made or whatever, I'm just thinking about my own experience in the game. I want something to chase, something to be excited about when I see a purple engram or get a faction package. Reforging was a horrible idea, and while the previous/upcoming system probably isn't perfect, it's better than reforging.

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      • I've read several replies from ppl saying it removes the fun of the grind. Does anyone still enjoy grinding? How about enough content so I can play for more than 10 minutes a day without being completely bored? Doesn't matter, when fallout four comes out I'll be burning my useless copy of Destiny. Better yet, I'll go green and turn it into a coaster for the coffee table. Yeah, the Destiny of Destiny is something to set a cold, perspiring drink upon...

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      • I feel like destiny needs to keep re forging but let you pick one perk to change and only one perk on a weapon you found. Pretty much steal Diablo 3's idea.

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      • I agree. A well thought out and informative post.

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        • Rerolling weapons eliminated the chase. Getting rid of it is the right move.

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          • Edited by Shelby: 9/5/2015 5:21:57 PM
            Here's why rerolling is an issue. Two things. Grenades and Horseshoes Shot Package Here, follow me a minute. The only reason people dislike it is because it makes two supreme perks OBSCENELY accessible. These perks were just as overpowered as before rolling, but they became an apparent issue, leading to a meta where the ONLY setups you saw, other than quality snipers, was Exotic HC, Shot Package shotgun, G&H Rocket Launcher. If rerolling were to come back, we'd fall back into this same situation again, except maybe with full auto and kneepads and lack a diverse meta that breeds a great number of play styles rather than the obvious one that slides everyone into the same mold.

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            • IMO it was bad to add re-rolling.Legendary rewards are useless now,at least you hoped for a nice roll when you see something on reward screen.

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              • I hope that re-rolling is gone for good.

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                • During the stream the option was still at the gunsmith

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                  • I remember getting vanguisher 3 times... and none of those three vanguishers had field scout... I totally agree

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                    • If this is all about the crucible, then might I suggest that you add #crucible to the tags?

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                      • Well it gives variety and bring back those moments from pre dark below destiny "oh, nice, I wish I would have those perks" whit addition of choice between 2 or so perks.

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                        • Whoa, they are removing the fact that we can reroll weapons? When was this mentioned, I would like to read up on it and their reasoning behind it.

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                          • Reforging was bs good riddance to it.

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                            • Weapon Rolling made weapons less special.

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                              • Rerolling weapons was a huge mistake for PvP.

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                              • RNG is cruel for sure. But really it's only shotguns and rocket launchers that everyone wants the same rolls on. No one can agree on what's best for other weapon classes. That's why those two classes are getting needs to perks, they're obviously too good.

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                                • I say throw out reroll and let us buy and instal custom parts. I wouldn't even mind having to do gunsmith bounties and quests to unlock different tier parts.

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                                  • I'll admit, I only read the title. but your choice of words is for that is all I needed for a counter. enabling weapon re-rolling was actually bad and lazy. it's a loot based game, not a perk based game. there's the bad part. rolling allows you to stand in one spot to get what you want rather than tryin to farm for it. there's the lazy part.

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                                  • Or it could just be made that rerolled weapons have the shitty tradeoffs like casket mag instead of field scout

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                                  • Bungie has scraped almost decision they have made with this game. When TTK drops, they will have accomplished that, and will have started completely over. Pretty easy for them, problems with Year One? Broken weapons and armor, terrible Raids that could be awesome, broken mechanics in certain events, why even bother to fix it? Let's just scrap the whole thing and start fresh!

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                                  • We payed for it..... Now they are deleting it an making us buy something else....... This is blatantly called fraud and the children using moms and dad credit cards have no sense of value or selfrespect for anything....

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