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Edited by Fromage of Havoc:
3/2/2015 11:23:39 PM
6
This is based on LaZy's feedback, where he suggested that the upgrade for weapons require DLC materials, but what if we took that a step further?
In TDB, you have [b]Eidolon Ally[/b], which can be upgraded to [b]Necrochasm [/b]once you obtain [b]Crux of Crota[/b] from the current endgame raid, CE, on hardmode. [b]What if the same was done with all raid weapons[/b]?
As it stands now, raid [b]weapons can still be used timelessly within Crucible[/b], but are attached to DLCs and are finite for use in PvE content.[b] A way to make them just as "timeless" in PvE[/b] but still encourage participation in all PvE content, including the current, the one before, and the core content/raid, Bungie could offer a way to upgrade the weapon's attack to the current DLC's weapons in a similar fashion to Necrochasm.
[b]I will use CE as an example, but this would also be true for future raids:[/b]
You have an "outdated" weapon you still love and use, Vision of Confluence, and you wished you could make it more up to date for PvE (lets pretend VoC is two DLCs behind and very low in attack). You already sport it on PvP, since it's one of your favorite Scouts to fall on.
You run CE hardmode, and [b]you get lucky enough to get a Crux of Crota[/b], but you have no intention of using or care for Necrochasm. [b]However, if you talk to Eris, you are able to turn in that Crux and the VoC you so much love for a new version of VoC.[/b]
[b]This new version has a different name (e.g. "Vision of Crota" or "Vision of Confluence II"), and now require new materials (aka Radient Energy)[/b] to cap at 331 (not 339). This way, people who want and love VoC now and for DLCs to come will run both the current and past contents to get an up-to-date version of it, and people who don't care and just want to skip to end game (as they would now), would just run CE. I understand that the RNG is strong behind this, but it provides a time sink that some players are willing to go through, as well as a way to add variety to the firearm Destiny has to bring and make the weapon as timeless in PvE as it is in PvP.
Perhaps it is too early to see the point of adding this now, as we only have one, barely two to be, DLCs, but I can see it working in the future. I can totally see people wanting to do this for Abyss Defiant and Black Hammer, for example.
[spoiler]EDIT: TLDR = read bold parts.[/spoiler]
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I like it. My only problem with taking old guns with you was how to make it a hard choice on what gun to upgrade...having the last boss in the current HM raid drop the item to use as the token is awesome and still makes RNG reward/punish, you still have to grind both for that token and then the current mats. Thoughts on whether or not you should be able to swap the raid perk(VOG vs Oracles/CE vs Hive Majors...). I feel you should be able to when you upgrade the gun, but if/when you do you lose the old perk and only by using same upgrade token can you change it back(just the perk, damage would not matter due to dmg caps vs levels).
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Edited by Fromage of Havoc: 3/3/2015 4:10:40 AM[quote]Thoughts on whether or not you should be able to swap the raid perk(VOG vs Oracles/CE vs Hive Majors...).[/quote] This is actually a key element I didn't take into consideration. I'm not sure whether this should be possible, how it should be possible, or if the perk would be lost altogether. Say, on one hand, if you keep the old perk (because nothing else is provided to you), it might make the old content, in this case VoG, easier, but it is old content. If you're forced to receive the new perk related to the DLC, in this case Hive Disruptor, you might bring it up to the current content altogether, including raiding, but you might also nullify the need or want to hang on to certain raid weapons with raid specific perk. There are also two other options: lose raid perks altogether, or have it be replaced by non-raid perks determined by Bungie. This way, you're bringing old content to the current date, still keeping raid weapons relevant if for the perks on said raid, but you may break some balance on pvp with those weapons if it's a generic perk replacement (maybe?). I'm not sure if or how they'd be selected as a choice though, what would be your approach on it?
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Not sure a generic perk would work...I still like the raid weapons for the raids(I use VoC pretty much all the way in VOG, but like my Crypt Dweller with Firefly/Explosive Rounds for CE). I'd probably say allow the option at upgrade to change the perk and then you either have to A) Waste a major upgrade material to change it back or B) Carry a second gun (upgraded or not), but B also would only really matter as long as "old" content stays relevant in some way. Right now VoG is still used for gearing to a degree(armor not so much but ppl love those guns...I'm looking at you Fatebringer), but once we move farther away, then those guns are going to fall off the scale(unless upgrades are put in)...if they put a weapon upgrade system in place, then old content is not as useless...guns can be upgraded so people will still run things like VoG even when the gun caps at 300(before upgrade) but even using that HoW dmg, VoG and CE will cap the dmg based on level. This would also help to keep older content in the loop...just because day 1 players may be sick of things like VoG, don't mean everyone is...and over time new blood will also be apart of the game, so having a reason to do the old raids is always nice. Gotta admit, I hope Bungie gets this part right, I don't mind the loss of old items when new content comes along(10 year WoW player), but I do like some of my guns I have, and not having to see them get dismantled would be awesome. They need to look at doing something with armor as well...maybe a simple transmorg idea to change your look(or do an upgrade to old gear as well maybe...)
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Pretty sound suggestion. I agree with transmorg, a lot of games have it these days, and I also find artillery in FPS to hold more variety and importance for a given level/tier than weapons on MMORPGs, so if they did something to this degree it would really add to the game.
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I love this idea.
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Edited by Fromage of Havoc: 3/2/2015 11:19:48 PMGlad you do! I think it gives more meaning/importance to something like Crux and raiding in general, in addition to what the OP and people upvoting the thread want (an option to upgrade). Hopefully other people like this idea too, even if they make adjustments to it.
