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3/1/2020 9:48:37 PM
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Why Rasputin won't side with the Darkness (lore perspective).

Already from a game mechanics point of view it would make more sense for Rasputin to side against the Darkness, as we obviously are getting Warmind/Russian themed armor in the next season, which seems to me to point to some sort of allegiance quest. I doubt that if Rasputin is sided with the Darkness that we'd be allowed to side with him as our first step to the Dark side. But that out of the way, I believe we have very solid evidence for why Rasputin would not join the Darkness. While I think the Osiris cutscene was cool, I find it far fetched to tell Rasputin to choose a side. If he truly was forced into a light or dark scenario then he has far more reasons to side with humanity than anyone else. That said, Rasputin really could lend a hand as if he does not help us he is almost assured destruction. To prove, or rather explain, why I believe he has no other option but us I'll list his basic relations with others races who may would side with the Darkness, or at least stand against the Light, and why humanity is his only potential friend. [u]Vex:[/u] While the majority won't actively follow the Darkness, there is the Sol Divisive. Rasputin has been combatting the Vex since before the Collapse. At Ishtar he was brought in to help combat the simulations of the Vex. This would be a logical enough reason to assume that Rasputin has no love of the Vex and vice versa, but he has continued hostile actions against the Collective into the new era. [u]Cabal:[/u] The cabal, while not as prominent as the Hive or Fallen when one thinks of claimants to the warmind's technology, throughout the Warmind dlc an apparent hostile link is shown between Rasputin and the Cabal, but this extends even further into the past. In the Grimoire card "Ghost Fragment: Rasputin 2" the eponymous Warmind is seen to send an orbital strike on a group of Vex and Cabal as a test of his recently awoken strength. The Cabal then cry out "Find the source!" Rasputin very apparently does not consider the Cabal potential allies, and likely would not consider Calus any better, especially with his connection to the Darkness. [u]Fallen:[/u] The fallen have actively sought to steal Rasputin's technology. From the Saber shank strike, to the Devils rummaging through his old vaults for SIVA. The Eliksni have shown nothing but interest in thieving from the Warmind and therefore an alliance between him and the Fallen is presumably all but impossible unless it be through humanity first. [u]Hive:[/u] Another faction who have actively fought against Rasputin. The entire Warmind dlc is an argument against Rasputin being allies with the Darkness. The worshippers of the Darkness have warred with Rasputin, it would make very little logical sense to enter into an alliance with the Darkness when it would likely include joining with the Hive as well. [u]The Darkness itself:[/u] There may be two schools of thought here. One would be Rasputin fought the Darkness before and he'll do it again, the other being that he'll join with them now that he knows the fight is hopeless. I believe Rasputin is too practical to not realize that the Darkness would not care a whit about him and would promptly destroy or corrupt him. With guardians now as an unplanned variable, Rasputin now may see an opportunity to actually win against the Deep, erasing his biggest failure. While Rasputin wishes to be autonomous and his own master, I still believe he would want to finish what he started, even if it were a part of his original programming. [u]Humanity:[/u] Rasputin was created by us, which is both a good and bad thing when it comes to his allegiance. On the one hand, he's told us he is own master in no uncertain terms and the Iron Lords have fought him and advocate against him. On the other hand, his only real (or potentially real) friend is Ana Bray. The only bengs who have helped him are human, and we share all of our common enemies. There is plenty of hostility between man and machine here, but with every time we have helped Rasputin we have grown closer to an alliance. Since the beginning of this story beat, Rasputin has given Osiris a lead to something in deeper Space. Many are still trying to make heads or tails of this, but if the tip really was helpful, then we may already be seeing further signs of cooperation. Anyway, what do you guys think? Which side of the so very thin line do you think he'll stand on?

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  • Makes sense makes sense

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  • I think Rasputin will slide with the darkness, as well as revealing he’s been evil all this time. We really need to take him down, if he is on the dark side or he gets hacked then he could easily wipe the last city off the earth... remember when he killed 100 iron lords?

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    • Just wanted to say I’m so glad that this is an actual post and not some ridiculous garbage about weapon shelving. Gg

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      • Rasputin has already shown he will kill thousands if it saves millions of people. What if he decides the only way humanity won't go extinct is if he sides with the Darkness?

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      • [b] [/b]

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      • Interested to see how this plays, if the allegiance aspect is true! The drifter was a bit of a let down in terms of impact - my hunter's a snitch, but he forgets that quite often. My warlock is loyal, but I'm not sure he cares. My titan's still stuck in the doorway! If this latest quest expands on that, it could be good... we have a few characters that aren't allied to the light, but have goodness in them: drifter, rasputin, mara sov (by association Petra??), spider and calus (perhaps a stretch, but certainly not an evil character) Maybe we will form a renegade super group; start up a TV show, sell the movie rights and spend the rest of our days at some sort of convention!

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      • I think ras is like the drifter: not on anyone's side, and only looking out for himself. In the case of ras, only looking out for humanity. I think he would make deals with both sides if it was for the betterment of humanity. That's why i think osiris confronted him with either you with us or against us. He's trying to force ras to pick a side, which i dont think he can do. That's where we come in and the whole season of the worthy. Think we are going to have to prove to ras we are the side he should pick, hence worthy. If we dont, think he'll just stay on the sidelines, not picking a side.

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      • It sounds very much like Rasputin said 'Darkness' when Osiris confronted him. BUT, was this Rasputin choosing a side, or was this Rasputin identifying Darkness in Osiris? He shut the doors behind Osiris, seemingly locking him in (although he'll probably be free by Season 10), and the new lore added on Bungie.net referred to Osiris interacting with a dark entity and taking a metal seed of some kind (I think Vex, but others have suggested the Tree of Ruin). Also, in the pre-Season of Dawn lore Drifter was weirded out by the Sundial core which was whispering. Whispering indicates Ahamkara or the Darkness (I think Worm Gods more specifically). So, I believe its possible Rasputin stating 'darkness' was his way of confronting Osiris. As OP says, Rasputin siding with the Darkness goes against most of the lore we have surrounding Rasputin, especially concerning his core protocols. That is, unless he believes siding with the Darkness is what is best for humanity in the long run: The Traveler (and the Light) is detrimental to the survival of humanity, so the Darkness' war with the Light will result in all threats being neutralised with humanity emerging intact

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      • I say fk dat raspberry puddin' mutha ----er. Dont need no machine tellin' me what to do. We should brain-jack his ass and make sure he follows us, into the darkness.

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      • Rasputin is a touchy subject since it was so heavily retconned in Warmind. There really isn't "new lore" to clarify what has been decanonized.

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      • I like the well thought pros and cons. However who is we and us? In a certain sense we the Guardians are much more offspring from the traveller than from humanity. As undead and cruel and uncompromising as the Hive. Does Rasputin trust the Traveller?

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        • I believe Rasputin, Light and Darkness will follow Hinduism. Where we have the God who creates, the God that Destroys and the God who sustains. I believe Rasputin will be the sustainer of balance and order. To Rasputin, there is no war between sides, there is only the cycle of life and death. Death is required of humanity for it to re-emerge from the ash. It would be better for Rasputin and humanity, if he (in some form) protected humanity and let the collapse happen again, so humanity can flourish once again without the influence of a big ball in the sky with an army of reanimated corpses. So, I think he aligns himself more toward the the ideals of the Vex rather than Light or Dark specifically. Which does align with my explanation of what Fractaline is, isn't and the potential of what it can be.

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        • My theory is that Rasputin wasn't going to side with the darkness, that he might not side with humanity but with the guardians alone. Maybe he would side with Ana and Ana would side with humanity? I don't believe he will side with the darkness, but I'm not entirely sure he'll aide humanity. He will probably see the last city as a means to an end, bait to lure the darkness in, since there are many of humanity spread everywhere.

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        • Read up the Last Days of Kraken. He fired on humans because he was acting under a command directive. He's both beneficial and detrimental.

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          • I'm just hoping he can do something. Anything.. and I don't care about the javelin.

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            • Rasputin wouldn’t side with the darkness; but it would be interesting to see what happens if he did.

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              • <I don't think anyone actually thought he'd side with the Darkness. It was more or less just a line between siding with us or siding with humanity exclusively, the latter would potentially lead to extreme measures in order to prevent the Second Collapse.>

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                • I don't see why he would ever side with the Darkness. Why would the Darkness make a deal with anyone? They would just as soon destroy Rasputin and be done with it.

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                • The question was less about whether Rasputin would choose the Light or the Dark and more about telling the Warmind that he must side with Humanity or he might as well be siding with the Darkness. There is no room for neutrality in the war to come. It is life or death.

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                • Osiris was telling him to choose a side because of Rasputins almost consistent neutrality and lack of involvement for or against humanity. (I say almost because he did help free the shard of the traveller). The other question you have to ask is 'What did Osiris see in the corridors of time/infinite forest?' as he says Rasputin knows why he's there. Did he see Rasputin acting against us? Or us only surviving because Rasputin helped us? Or our complete destruction due to Rasputins inaction. Or did he see Rasputin attack the traveller which forced it to stay on earth and therefore caused all the future events we've lived through and Osiris is holding him responsible?

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