That's not the quote. The quote is: [i]"Those who know do not speak. Those who speak do not know." [/i] But there is answering Zen aphorism: [b]" Zen cannot be spoken, but you have to say something". [/b] Both quotes speak to a the formless ESSENCE that lay at the root of all things. The Silence out of which all Sound (for example) is born. That aspect of Reality...literally....cannot be fully captured in words. So any effort to do so is---by its very nature---inaccurate. But the Zen saying (with the practical bent of the Chinese and Japanese) calls attention to the fact that understanding that is not shared....DIES WTIH THE PERSON WHO UNDERSTANDS...and is therefor of little value. So if you are going to communicate the knowledge YOU HAVE TO SAY SOMETHING....while honoring the fact that what you speak of are but road signs pointing towards that understanding....and not the understanding itself. However, what I'm doing with respect to Bungie is what Wall Street analysts get paid to do every day. A job my brother used to do many moons ago....so I know what to look for.

ALL quotes are open to subjectivity and debate. Scholars debate these statements all the time. And yet, your posts are full of them. How about another one, more simple. [i]I never think of the future. It comes soon enough.[/i] -Albert Einstein. lol. Any quote, from any author, can be used in various enumerable ways. The bottom line still remains. You say the writing is clear, unambiguous and on the wall. Very plain to see. My question still exists: When? On what calendar date will all this bad stuff happen? When you answer this, THEN I’ll listen, otherwise you’re just guessing.

No. They aren't. Because....as a Zen practitioner for over 20 years...I have directly experienced what it is both quotes are speaking of....and I am aware of WHY that of which they refer to cannot be communicated in words. The aspect of Reality to which they point can only be truly understood by those who HAVE experienced it directly. Like I did for the first time at the age of 28. You are misusing a statement that is in reference to something VERY specific....and trying to blow it up to a generality for which it was NEVER intended. You can try it.....but I'm here at the gates to not allow you to get away with it. Because allowing you to so that would diminish what is actually being referred to. ...and you are still trying to move the goalposts. I can explain in very granular detail why Bungie is "not fine". Nothing I can say---There is not a word of Zen that I can say---that can get you to care if you don't already. [quote]On what calendar date will all this bad stuff happen? When you answer this, THEN I’ll listen, otherwise you’re just guessing.[/quote] No True Scotsman ....or the Appeal to Purity...fallacy. Just because I can't give you a specific DATE as to when the Heat Death of the Universe will occur, is not "proof" that the astrophysics and quantum mechanics behind it are wrong. Just because I can't give you the precise date when Betelgeuse (a dying star in the shoulder of the Orion constellation) will go supernova, doesn't mean that the science pointing to the fact that it will...are wrong.

YOU are the one claiming to be a SME in video game design. YOU are the one claiming to be a SME in publicly traded stock analysis; my understanding is you achieved this level of expertise bc ahem..., your brother did it many moons ago. lol. YOU are the one claiming the ability to be prescient bc of all this expertise you possess. Who knows, maybe all this ties into YOU being a SME as a Zen Practicioner. But, my point is, that it WILL die. Along with everything else. It has a finite lifespan. Everybody knows it will die, at some point in the future. Regardless of it being next week or next decade. The reasons for it dying will be innumerable. Way more numerous than just some fixation on enhancement cores. My personal friends quit this game bc Trials went on hiatus. They will return if/when Trials returns. I know more ppl who’ve walked away from the game currently bc strikes, nightfalls, story is over 7 months old, no talks of cores, just talks about being tired of same old same old, wrt activities. It’s gotten old and boring. No throwings of a fit, just simply walking away and saying if/when things change, I’ll take another look. In other words, a mature and unbiased approach to this game and developer. One based on objectivity, one not based emotionally, bc, ahem..., I didn’t get my way.

"The proof of the pudding is in the eating." I posted this 7 months ago: https://www.bungie.net/en/Forums/Post/248852418 ...and if you're willing to be honest, its clear that I was right. When I first saw Jon Weisznewski give an interview back in Dec. of 2015, I was OUTRAGED by what I'd heard as a PVE player. I heard someoen who controlled the Destiny 1 sandbox who had little insight into the nature of the game he was working on....and little respect for who plays them, and why they play them. I started sounding the alarm back THEN....that his ideas for the game grated against the identity of the game....and worse, that they werent' EVER going to to work. ...and they eventually gave us Destiny 2....dual primaries....power weapons....and a game that basically had all the space magic stripped out of it. In fact, this game is STILL hobbled (in its abilitty to generate loot) by many of his ideas as Weapon Design lead. I really don't think I have to point out that I was right. I also said when Bungie announced they were going to fixed rolls for weapons that----as a loot-game---that decision was extremely risky, and that it would blow up the game if they didn't handle it right. Which ---of course----they didn't, and----of course----it DID. So now we have a loot game where 80% of the loot table is USELESS because those weapons are locked into combinations of perks that are weak and functionally useless. [quote]But, my point is, that it WILL die. Along with everything else. It has a finite lifespan. Everybody knows it will die, at some point in the future.[/quote] Thank you, [i]Lord Buddha[/i]....but I'm already aware of The Cosmic Joke. EVERYTHING that has a beginning has an end. EVERYTHING that exists in Form...eventually comes to end. Even the Universe itself can't escape the Second Law of Thermodynamics. But as one Theravadan Buddhist master once said, [i] "Just because all things are finite does not mean that we do not care for them properly while they are here. We do not disrespect relationships because they are not eternal. When things come to us we welcome them. When they leave us we do not cling or pursue. That is the nature of non-attacthment." [/i] Like so many you mistake non-attachment for DETACHMENT. If the game dies....it dies. That was inevitable. If Bungie dies....it dies. That too is inevitable. All tings turn to dust. But that does not mean that I refuse to care for...and fight for both WHILE THEY STILL EXIST. It does not mean I turn my back upon something....or refuse to care for it...simply because it cannot last forever. Sometimes caring for something means being willing to CONFRONT and try to EDUCATE someone who is responsible for it....and is NOT caring for it properly. [quote]One based on objectivity, one not based emotionally, bc, ahem..., I didn’t get my way.[/quote] And that's where you miss the mark. You assume that this is about gettign my way. When its about this game reaching its potential and being what it is. Or have you stopped to consider----in your detachment---WHY it is this game continues to struggle and stumble after almost 5 years...... ....while The Division 2----a franchise that got off to even a worse start than Destiny did----is cruising along with happy players, and recieving critical acclaim? Of course you didn't. Its the same reason why one person or group succeeds in anything....while another struggles. The successful group was willing to do the things the strugglers werent'. The often difficult, humbling and even downright humiliating things. Massive was willing to swallow their pride. Bungie hasn't. Massive was willing to admit that they were inexperienced and needed to learn. Bungie isn't. Massive was willing to give up control and let their community TEACH THEM how to make the game they wanted to play. Bungie always retreats into arrogance and a "We Know What You Want Better Than You Do."....and the fact is they don't. Massive had a clear vision of their game.....what its identity was....and was willing to do anything it took to realize that vision. Bungie's only consistent agenda seems to be one of CONTROL. Every step along the path of this game has been defined by FIGHTS for control Fights with Microsoft. Fights within Bungie. Fights with Activision. Fights with their own customers. Fight. Fight. Fight. So busy fighting for that narcissistic need to control....that they've lost sight of what the whole point of this was in the first place. They. Are. Lost right now.

What population does the Division2 show in its latest 24 hour data pull from their API? I have no issues stepping aside and letting the TRUE subject matter experts (aka Bungie) build the game they think is best. If it works so be it, if it doesn’t, the lights will still be on in Bellevue and Bungie will make changes needed at the time. It’s that simple. This forum was largely behind both random rolls and dual primaries being inserted into the game, from what I recall. And it’s one of the reasons Bungie should pay attention to its internal metrics equally as much as the demands of a few hundred ppl, with alternate/multiple accounts on a forum where the lowest common denominator is age 13 and have been to the farm.

Do you hear any community complaints about the Division 2? Cause I’m hearing nothing but praise.

Again, What’s the daily population?

Not published...and not [i]**relevant**.[/i] You are losing on the merits...and you are now trying to lay down a smoke screen to cover your escape. Not taking the red herring, champ. Frustration with Bungie is at an all-time high in the Destiny community. Whereas The Division 2s community is quietly content.....currently discussing the varies test patches that are on the PTS server and Massive is letting PC players preview....while we await the raid and the first major post-release content drop.

[quote]Frustration with Bungie is at an all-time high in the Destiny community.[/quote] You don’t speak for the Destiny community. Not even a tiny portion of it. Frustration within you may be representative of your specific situation, but you do NOT speak for the community. Nor do I. Populations DO matter, if they didn’t ppl around here, including You, wouldn’t use them as a weapon against Bungie. Same logic applies to Bungie, via ATVI, pushing its metrics as “record breaking” etc... The fact that Bungie publishes daily population amazes me. Very few other developers are that transparent. Apparently, Massive isn’t one of those who are. Even you have told me recently: [quote]Those with nothing to hide, hide nothing[/quote] I would much rather have 250 ppl loudly complaining out of 250,000 daily than 250 total, daily, who are happy and don’t complain. Because an objective mind is well aware that there will be those who complain loudly soley because they can. And there are those who blindly follow anybody regardless of what they do. I’m excited for Any & All commercially successful video games, it helps the industry as a whole, including the Division 2. If that game is your cup of tea, by all means, go knock it out, have fun, enjoy it every chance you get! Me personally, I’m super excited for Borderlands 3. But it won’t replace Destiny 2, it can’t. I played the Division, quite a bit. I’m happy the Division 2 and Massive are your go to places for entertainment. I just don’t see the need to demand Bungie emulate and copy anybody else. I would much rather see Bungie forge her own path than trail along behind others. Even with failure as a possibility.