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10/13/2018 10:31:38 AM
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That’s map design...
....and getting outplayed.
If you want play aggressively then you need a shotgun or an smg.
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”outplayed” OMEGALUL. Could you imagine what it would take in map desgin to kill shotguns? Yea gl with that map design
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Try the new map in Unknown Space. I played a Control match that was being fought with snipers and Jade Rabbits. The laughter of fools....
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Yea ive played that map several times in comp. And people use pulse rifles and shitguns in breakthrough. Snipers are garbage cuz of go figure
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Because the game mode forces you into close proximity. Of course people are going to use shotguns....
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Thats what im saying is the ISSUE. If youre not using a shotgun youre handicapping yourself due to shitguns beings such hardmeta
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No. You are handicapping yourself because you want to pick the [i]wrong[/i] tool for the job. If you are playing a game that forces you into close combat, and shotguns [i]arent [/i] dominating? You don’t have a balanced sandbox. You’ve [i]broken [/i] shotguns and they’re underpowered.
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Youre literally emphasizing my point. Not using a shotgun is literally just using the ”wrong” tool. Does that seriously sound like the game promotes variance and player choice? Where youre forced into using a certain weapon cuz its so much better than every other choice. Sounds like a nerf/chbge is in need if thats the case in a shooter
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You promote variety by designing maps and game modes properly. Not by breaking weapons. Destiny 1 nerfed shotguns 23 times and never fixed the “shotgun problem” because shotguns were never really the problem in the first place.
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Nerfing/buffing weapon really is how you promote variance. It allows other weapons to take thier place and have their own time to shine, this is literally exactly what has happened. Shotguns just took smgs place in the meta, therefore basically breaking SMFs as they are now completely useless. Bungie needs to have an active eye on the PvP scene if they want it to flourish, they need to regularly change and balance it without affecting PvE numbers, they need to put out patches with proper number that tell people whats going to be viable and whats not. And if people arent happy with a certain change, well hey guess what its probably going to be changed in a upcoming regular balance patch. LITERALLY just look at how league of legend does this. And this games PvP would be incredibly good, promote variance and be refreshing.
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Edited by TheArtist: 10/14/2018 8:47:18 AMWrong again. Adjusting the sandbox is how you [i]fine tune.[/i] Buffs and nerfs can’t overcome design flaws in the game. They can’t overcome repetitive map designs that all favor the same style of play and funnel people into the same fight at the same ranges. They can’t overcome game modes that do the same thing as the maps. They can’t overcome a designer who is committed to working off the formula of a [i]dying[/i] franchise (Halo), that is incompatible with the design choices they made for THIS GAME. They can’t work when you are working the wrong end of the problem. You can reduce shotguns range to [i]ZERO[/i], and all you’ll do is BREAK THEM IN PVE, while they’ll just work like shoulder charge does now in pvp. [b]Because you still won’t have fixed the real problem. That Bungie refuses to allow primary weapons to kill fast enough to limit shotgun usefulness to the range that it can shoot.[/b] Take distance off its range, and players will just start their rush that much [i]closer.[/i] Which is what happened [b]the twenty two OTHER times they were nerfed.[/b]
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Do you even understand how buffing/nerfing works? Changing weapon numbers allows others to gain the upper hand in those ranges. Buff SNGs effective range, buff ARs damage output, nerf pulse rifles flinching and/or accuracy. This is exactly how item dependent games work. READ carefully as im about to say what ive already said twice now. THEY NEED TO SEPERATE PVP FROM PVE. The game tailores to close quater combat, that of which you use in that range outmatches all other choices. Buffing primary damage isnt the answer since it will kill fusions and snipers even harder. And slowing down the sandbox movement will completely kill Cqc and without removing radar will force the game back into teamshooting. If anything they should learn to compromise. For the casual players that like to disconnect their brain when playing this game can be allowed to use shotguns or whatever in QP, meanwhile they should either remove special in comp or just remove comp. (On a sidenote, i really dont think you realize how much money game development costs, the initial cost of development doesnt even come close to the total revenue earned from the released product. They have plenty of money to put out regular patches/content, they just wont do it cause it doesnt inherently make them money.)
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Edited by TheArtist: 10/14/2018 9:33:18 AMSon. I forgotten more about how these games work than you could possibly teach me. Bungie has made it clear that they will never separate the sandboxes because they consider the unified sandbox part of the core identity of the game. Something they said repeatedly during [i]Destiny 1.[/i] Starting to see the pattern yet?
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Do you not realize this is the single reason pvp in this game is so trash?
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Literally everything youre mentioning is what I am doing, I got lunas howl solo with a 65% winrate and Redrix last season, trust me when I say Im way above the average when it comes to PvP in this game. Still denying that shotguns are underpowered is just delusional to me. The killfeed in almost every single game is filled with shotguns. On PC its even worse: you have ALOT more variables such as hearing and the general speed of which you can turn and/or react with. Pair that up with the completely unneccessary target aqusition and youve got yourself the worst PvP platform on the market. Shotguns put way too much of an emphasis on META. The game has been dumbed down to such a degree that if you even try to use something that requires the least amount of brainpower you will be outgunned by that of which is meta.
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Edited by TheArtist: 10/14/2018 12:24:40 AMOkay. You’d rather whine. So be it. Good luck with that. Problem for you is that Bungie went down this road with people like you in Destiny 1. So they know [i]exactly[/i] where it leads, and that the complaining never stops.
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Complaining will never stop. Its always like this with games that have standardised items and Metas. You handle it by adjusting things regularly. Just look at how league of legends does it, and that game is the largest game in the world on PC.
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And you can do that in a game that is a pure shooter. You can’t do that in THIS game because it shares the same gear system with pve, and a loot-based RPG. Vanilla Destiny 2 tried it your way and it nearly destroyed the game. Bungie took a huge PR hit, and spent millions of dollars putting this game back together and repairing the damage. They aren’t going to break it a second time. And Josh Hamrick is John-I’ve-Never-Met-A-Nerf-I-Didn’t-Like-Weisznewski. He isn’t going to nerf shotguns 23 times in a vain attempt at trying to please you people. Which is good because this franchise wouldn’t survive it a second time. If you want to play Halo, go play Halo. This game will never be what you want it to be.
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You really outta stop refrencing to D1. Shit is over, its a new game that for some -blam!-ing reasons faces the same issues. Also, did i ever state as if shotguns was THE only problem? Shotguns are def a problem, since alot of it came with the same patch that werent there before. I also really love you pulling the ”back in the old days” card. Guess what, shit is over and it doesnt mean shit cuz it doesnt apply to D2. Its a different -blam!-ing game and it shouldnt share the same problems.
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ROFLMAO. Great another kid who thinks that nothing important happened in the world before him. Let me put the dots close together enough so that even you can understand it. 1. This “shotgun problem” has been with this franchise for four years. Vanilla Destiny 2 just HID the problem by basically removing them from the game in pvp. 2. That didn’t work because it broke the game on the pve side....and since the majority of the player base plays pve rather than pvp..... well.... 3. No amount of nerfs to shotguns will fix this. Bungie nerfed them 23 times IN EVERY WAY POSSIBLE... and people like you still complained bitterly. 4. Nerfs don’t work because they don’t address the problem of the SPEED OF PLAYER MOVEMENT. SHAVING THREE FEET OFF THE SHOOTING DISTANCE OF MY SHOTGUN ISNT GOING TO HELP YOU IF I CAN COVER FIFTY YARDS IN THE TIME IT TAKES YOUR WEAPON TO KILL. I’ll just start my rush three feet CLOSER.
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Well hey guess what; THEY FIXED THE PROBLEM BY OUTRIGHT REMOVING SHOTGUNS FROM THE ENERGY SLOT. There are SEVERAL very viable shotguns in the heavy slot. Bungies problem is their complete incompetence in seperating PvE from PvP. Them not being able to nerf something in PvP without it affecting PvE is a -blam!-ing joke and is frankly just a bad job on their part. I bet your ass that if they actually fix the player movement like you say they should in order to fix close up oneshot capability, Theres going to be so much more complaints than the people on complaining about shotguns. Oneshot mechanics in this game should stay in the heavy slot, thats literally what the heavy slot is for. Shotguns would instantly be better if they remove one shot out of the two, cuz guess what, this game has a melee button.
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Edited by TheArtist: 10/14/2018 8:36:42 AMAnd they broke the game, and nearly destroyed a franchise worth billions in the process. About as effective as curing a headache by cutting your head off. [i]Which is why they —special weapons—-are back, and why they aren’t going anywhere.[/i] Bungie took a huge hit to their reputation and their profits doing what people like you wanted. They aren’t going to do it a second time. Because they know that the complaining won’t stop until shotguns are effectively [b]removed[/b] from the game..... ....and this game doesn’t need pvp that badly. This is a pve game that is dragging pvp behind it. Trials is in mothballs and yet this game is seeing its greatest levels of player engagement. Do the math, kid.
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Jesus dude you realize how extremelly popular this game was at release? Not having shotguns was a problem for YOU guys, the problem was how empty shelled the game was at release resulting in a MASSIVE playerbase drop once people hit max power. PvP was by far in its best state and wouldve been very good with S1s balancing and removal of radar. Saying that the removal of the special slot nearly broke the game is such a biased opinion, what broke the game is all the shitty antics they put behind this game and how sloppy made this game is/was. The backlash came from the xp throttling, CoO and the winter event.
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Edited by TheArtist: 10/14/2018 9:13:00 AMTeenagers...... I’m going to say this once and then stop clearly wasting my time trying to get through to you. 1. This game has three years of history that cannot be ignored simply because you were not around for it. 2. Removing special weapons BROKE THE GAME. It broke the power-fantasy essential to the game’s appeal in pve. It severely limited what kind of content Bungie could design, severely limited what loadouts were viable in pve. It made end-game pve frustrating and tedious because you hit a [b]damage-output ceiling.[/b] People didn’t buy this game to chisel away at bosses with [i]primaries.[/i] 3. PVE is vital to the survival of this franchise and pvp is not. Which is why this game has not missed a beat despite its signature “competitive” game mode being in indefinite hiatus. 4. Because of that history you want to ignore, Bungie isn’t going to go down that road again. People who survive train wrecks generally don’t [b]repeat [/b] the mistakes that led to the first one. Now goodbye.
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Jesus you really cant -blam!-ing read at all. Im not saying at all that specials shouldnt be a thing in pve, it def should. It shouldnt in PVP
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Edited by TheArtist: 10/14/2018 9:29:44 AMAnd like a typical teenager, you think you know everything that matters. [b]Bungie isn’t going to seperate the sandboxes, or tune the game in anyway that results in weapons performing substantively different in pve versus pvp.[/b] In their eyes: One Game. One Gear System. But then you’d know that if you’re weren’t so busy trying to dismiss three years of Destiny 1. They’ve either tried (and failed with) everything you’re saying. Or they are ideologically opposed it. Unbelievable.
