{{
`${userDetail.user.displayName}${userDetail.user.cachedBungieGlobalDisplayNameCode ? `#${standardizeBungieGlobalCode(userDetail.user.cachedBungieGlobalDisplayNameCode)}` : ""}`}}
{{getUserClans()}}
Edited by Lord Bird I:
9/4/2015 3:02:34 AM
322
Mr. Fruit's View on Titans and Class Balancing
EDIT: Please ignore the poll, I accidentally posted it unfinished and now I can't change it.
[quote]As to all those who don't believe that Titans are the worst, and are trying to refute me. I could spend a whole video talking about it, but almost every point you all bring up - the other classes either have it built-in, or an exotic that outclasses it. Bubblebro is priceless in PvE. But for PvP, Titans are just at a clear disadvantage. As a person who has used every class, and every subclass, and has most time put into a Titan this is the consensus I've come to.
Thankfully it looks like Sunbreaker is going to change things for Titans in PvP, but let's look at it realistically:
Slowest agility : Yes you can use the "triple" tap jump to speed around, but it's not intuitive to most and it's not always practical to run around doing it in PvP and in a gunfight, you don't have the same speed to strafe or even run away - not to mention blink is just a get out of jail free card. It's so easy to avoid supers, heavies etc with blink, but titans can't get away so even overall titan's k/d usually don't match up with the other classes.
It's the "TANKY" class : We're supposed to be the frontline, however even when we max our armor out we only have 1 more health than a hunter in PvP I believe, and are tied with Warlocks. The Ram alone gives Warlocks like 22 more health in PvP which is insane.
Melee : We're supposed to be the melee class, but it's a fact our melee is the worst. No range to it. Hunters are above it especially with blink strike glitch, and the warlock is just a mile ahead of them both. Yes we have shoulder charge, but as you can see it's pretty easy to counter if you know what you're up against and titans also have to usually prep for shoulder charge beforehand knowing when it'll be up after sprinting, and how long it'll be up.
Supers: The Fist of Havoc is situational, rarely nets several kills, and you almost feel punished for using it at times because it always seems like you need to save it for a cluster, which rarely seems to happen. Warlocks have the same thing in the form of Nova Bomb, which they can send from a safe distance. Hunters have a super that pretty much guarantees 2-4 kills every activation.
Exotics: Yes the Saint-14 is great... in PvE. It can help occasionally in PvP, but using bubblebro in PvP is already putting you at a disadvantage. Ruin Wings are bugged and only useful for PvE. Arma is great for two grenades which can help, but warlocks have that perk built into their subclass already. Pretty much any other exotic is completely niche, or just offers a perk that's already in your subclass. Feedback fences? It tickles the enemy, I've gotten 1 kill across my hours of playtime using it. PvP you just have nothing that really helps, and so I often use Inmost light just because it lets me take 2 skills for my super.
You can all sit here and argue on and on about it, but I can say without a doubt that Bungie is sitting on data that backs up exactly what I'm saying - especially PvP. I talked to Luke Smith and Mark about this while I was at bungie for hours on end. The Titans just don't have anything they really shine at, except for being the staple for most PvE encounters with the Bubble. They told me they're aware of it and are always looking at ways to fix it. So fingers crosses, but even Bungie knows Titans are a notch down from the others.
The bubble is near useless in PvP because it can't protect against supers, you can't use it as a reactive defense because everything bursts it. Anyway like I said I could go on and on and on about this because as someone who wants the Titans so badly to be really good, it hurts to realistically look at it and know that we're just not at the same tier with the current build. I'm not going to respond to the comments to this because it won't get us anywhere, you're always free to disagree.
/rant[/quote]
-Mr. Fruit
This comment can be found here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DrH5FmnCm8c
This is probably the best argument for class balancing I've seen in a long time. The video (Specifically the first round) shows the clear disadvantages that the Titan has in the melee department, even with shoulder charge. And in the round where they were all using an auto rifle, Mr. Fruit absolutely crushed Blue and Rhabby, so he's likely more skilled than them, but in the other rounds in this series it doesn't look like it because abilities were allowed in those rounds.
Other Thread with more evidence: https://www.bungie.net/en/Forum/Post/147725199/0/0
Statistics thread:
https://www.bungie.net/en/Forum/Post/151174823/0/0
Tell me if you agree or disagree, and if you do disagree please give a valid argument rather than "Fist of Havoc/Shoulder Charge/Lightning Grenades is/are OP" or at least give some form of evidence to prove it.
Thanks for Reading!
-
21 RepliesCan safely say my KDR is virtually equal with all classes. GS Strengths: - Trip mine can net a lot of cheeky kills if less than 195 total health. - GG is by far the easiest super to use for multikills every time. - Jump system is easy mode, quick and easy to control. - Throwing knife is very powerful in skilled hands. GS weaknesses: - Trip mine can be a massive troll if many enemies run more than 194 total health. - GG activation makes you a sitting duck for a second with no overshield. - Throwing knife overiding a lunge melee is almost painful at times. - No really good tag grenades. - No access to overshields, ever. BD strengths: - Arcbolt grenade is king of finishing/pre damaging enemies (rushing grenades). - Blink (especially with arc bolt) is easy mode with handcannons/shotguns (Especially rumble). - Invis isn't OP but it can be useful at times. - Weapon swap speed is godlike in a game like destiny. - Arcblade is tanky and allows pretty solid 2-3 kills everytime and sometimes 4/5. - Blink strike glitch allows one hit kills from front some times, also it's especially good for trapping GG as they run into a room. BD weaknesses: - Only overshield comes in super. - Melee is almost painful when it's not charged. - Arcblade in laggy games, you might as well have a butter knife. SS strengths: - FLAME SHIELDS FOR DAYS - Double grenades or a hugely op DoT tag grenade (trials king), sticky grenades also have amazing aim assistance. - Access to Ram (only exotic I'll mention) gives numerous benefits, especially thorn survival and no instant snipe on res. - Self res is very useful in trials. - Melee range means even regular melee attacks are very useful for finishing enemies. - The right super set up allows you to out melee a BD in arcblade. SS weaknesses: - SOOOOO SLOOOOOOWWWWW, the jump is like painting a target on your back. - Super is super easy to counter if no idiot gives them a flame shield. - Self res can mean zero super kills all game if against non idiots. Voidwalker strengths: - Blink. - Ram (especially with shotgun+blink) gets healing with this class. - Axoin bolt can hunt a target who was behind a wall to the grenade. - Novabomb can be a super easy 2-4 piece. - Scatter grenades (with manacles obviously) are just free kills if an enemy is alone/stationary, and can even be good group killers with bloom. - Surge (kill bonus from melee) is very underated - Good arcblade counter. Voidwalker weaknesses: - More often than not you will get one kill with nova bomb, unless you horde it. - Axoin bolt is the only tag grenade that can be avoided (and easily), meaning with out manacles all void grenades are pretty lame. Striker strengths: - DOUBLE LIGHTNING GRENADES (or single), used for tatical tagging around corners, zone rapage and all-a-round carnage! - Storm fist, while short ranged does the most damage from any direction and can really help get super back. - Shoulder charge is a super effective tool when used intelligently, also is a good noob crutch due to no blink. - Fist of Havoc is by far the most reliable super, if you don't get a kill that is your own -blam!-ing fault, Also allows you to counter every other super with ease. Amazing AoE allows for the most carnage in the right situation. - Good jump system to shotgun someone on a platform above you. Strikers weaknesses: - Jump isn't as slow as sunsingers, but still is very clunk to try and play a high movement game. - Melee range is awful, even when charged up. - Initial lightning grenade burst will hurt you, unlike arc bolts and fire bolts. - Shitty helmets, off topic but true. Defender strength: - Spike grenades are underated and super effective, especially two of them in control zones. - Suppressor grenades are excellent for any PvP situation, and will be godlike in the new 'Mayhem' mode. - Armor of light = free kills when people stupidly run into your bubble assuming you only have blessings. - Weapons / Blessings of light = huge team advantage, especially in games like skirmish and clash where kills are the only concern. - Bubble is just all around useful in control for zones and heavy times. - Force barrier is a nice overshield that regens. Defender weaknesses: - Only real super that forces you to still use gun/play skill to get kills out of it. - Bubble is a big sign saying 'Hey launch super here'. - Shitty jump as above. - Melee is pointless when uncharged. - Force barrier requires a kill so not as effective as it could be. - No tag grenades. All in all, every class is just as effective as the each other when it comes down to it. Titans are just pissy because they want access to the blink+shotgun/melee play style. You have shoulder charge which is all of that in one, yes shoulder charge is not God mode, but it sure as hell does just fine for me. The removal of ram will fix the health balancing issues, hopefully when it's re-added it is balanced. Also don't bother telling me I'm not a fair judge, my titan and hunter kills are low because I deleted them awhile back and made three warlock, then reverted back to one of each during HoW. In fact, titan was the character I got to rank 5 in the first two IB's.
